Lacustricola katangae

[Dan_G_Calgary]

I am so stoked about this! I almost missed the Fish club meeting, and the opportunity to buy more of FCG's.... giraffe plants.. :laugh:

So quite a while back (see START THE CAR! thread) I got a pair of L. Katangae. They layed about 7 eggs, and then the female just up and died...

I hatched out those 7 eggs and have been raising them ever since... well about a week back, just for giggles I threw a spawning mop in the tank. Earlier this evening, I pulled it out, and was flicking the baby cherry shrimp off of it back in to the tank, and of course the Spixi snails had laid their goopy mess of eggs in it, and WHOA! That isn't a snail egg!! or that! or that! I found 14 eggs! I didn't think they were quite ready for spawning. their eggs are HUGE, but they disagree!

Really excited that I got it on the second generation. Hopefully will get enough fry to get them on the BAP this go 'round.

[vince0]

i call dibs in 75 days to be the first on the list to get some! That is if you will let me

[Dan_G_Calgary]

Haha! You called it! It's like calling shotgun on a ride!

You have first dibs on a pair from these eggs when they are off the BAP. (which should be roughly 75 days).

Now, the tricky part for you will be being patient. I won't need all 7 of this group once I have a reasonable amount of fry and egg production, so will likely put a pair from them in either the Edmonton or Calgary auction...

Will you wait for your FREE pair from these possible fry? OR will you take the known and bid on them at the auction? Oooooh. So many possibilities! The blue pill or the red pill? which will it be for our intrepid young hero, Vince?:laugh: Stay tuned!

[vince0]

In the spirit of the new millenium, im gonna eat both pills and deal with the consequences lol.... Ill probably bid on the auction ones... even if i don't get them it'll drive the price up lol

[Dan_G_Calgary]

So these eggs are quite large, and yellowish. That kind of surprised me. Will be funny as all **** if they somehow turn out to be Spixi eggs. I'll definetely have spixi 'egg on my face'!

I'm pretty sure not, but I couldn't find any pics or their eggs, or actually of katangae on the net.

If I can't find any, I will take a few and post them.

Edit: Found them under Aplocheilichthys katangae. None of them were very good pics, so I think I will try to take one or two, and of their eggs.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

found some bad pics in my photobucket account. Will have to do until I can take some good ones.

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae184/Grimblyd/Picture018-1.jpg

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae184/Grimblyd/Picture016-1.jpg

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae184/Grimblyd/Picture012-3.jpg

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae184/Grimblyd/Picture010-3.jpg

[Dan_G_Calgary]

collected 4 more eggs late last night (around 10:45).

Interesting note on the eggs. I rest the mop on a styrofoam lid when I am searching for eggs, and often it seems the eggs often end up on the styrofoam! So I shook the mop and a few fell out! They don't seem super sticky like other eggs are on mops.

Really need to clean this mop out. Damn spixi eggs have it all gooped up.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

roughly 10 eggs still eyed up. Some fungus development in tank and quite a few bad eggs. Added methylene blue to light coloring. Eggs that are bad immediately take in the blue coloring to identify themselves as 'dispose'. Egg recovery in the adults is sporadic. The mop is constantly full of cherry shrimp and asolene spixi snails and snail eggs. Still finding one or 2 every day though. might move the parents to a more secluded tank. Also want to try some eggs on peat, but not with this first batch. Need more eyed up eggs! what is with all my species running so close to the 10 minimum!

[CACAdmin]

So the shrimp and the snails are beating you to most of the eggs in the mop, eh? You're just going to have to give up going to work and check the mop every few hours. :wink: :laugh:

[Dan_G_Calgary]

no eggs have hatched yet. I can see the babies in there, but nothing has hatched.
It has been very cold in my fish room due to the cold weather we have been having, and recently found one of my furnaces wasn't working very well due to a plugged up filter (main floor, which sevices the basement). Probably delayed the hatching of the eggs. it's warmer in the room now so expect to see some hatching soon. Would love to try some peat hatching of these guys, but need to get them up and swimming around first.

[CACAdmin]

Best of luck. Hope to hear of some eggs hatching soon.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

Two hatched. They never looked right though. I think the variable temperature in my fish room with the stupid weather we have been having might have claimed them. Still collecting a lot of eggs, but no fry yet.

[CACAdmin]

Keep collecting. You never know which ones will bring success.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

So this is an ongoing kind of puzzlement. I get one or 2 hatching, then they just don't make it. Now I raised the current 7 to adulthood from the pair I bought, so it's not like I haven't done it before. But something I am doing isn't working.

My thoughts, open to your input and suggestions.

these eggs are taking a long time to hatch. probably a bit too cold in my fishroom. Might have to float the eggs in a heated tank for better success?
I have gotten a bit smarter from Gary Langes talk. he mentioned scum forming on the bottom of the container after a couple of weeks. I knoew about scum on the top, so keep a bubbler and do water changes, but the scum may be overtaking these eggs with their extended hatch times.

Might put an eyed up group on peat. then hatch them out.
start changing the container every week so I don't lose so many on the way to eyeing up. find a warmer location for the container... wait till summer when it will be overall warmer!

[GaryofMontreal]

I expect you need a tumbler, like with mouthbrooder eggs. Lampeye eggs need a current. I put mine in a plastic strainer or even a net. Position them in a snail-free tank over a bubbling air driven filter. Make sure the bubbles pass close to the eggs, just enough to keep things moving. Angle the net so the hatched fry can swim out, and check the surface daily. The perfect hatchout container is a small aquarium - I use fives.
My Procatopus aberrans are hatching at 18-20 days like that, with a way better hatch rate than when I sat them in a container. I have a dozen in one tank, seven in another, and in that latter, still twenty eyed eggs waiting. They are a week overdue, with a few still hatching daily, at 22c.
Eggs picked the same day can hatch over several days, so be patient. The fry are small. Normanni can take bbs right off, but aberrans need finer food - rainbow type fry food - for the first week. Growth is uneven, as two fish from the same day don't grow at the same rate. So you may want the fine stuff even longer, depending on the hatching time. I think Lacustricola have larger fry, but I have never even seen katangae.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

change up. 'If banging your head against the wall hurts, well, stop banging your head against the wall'

I think heat is the missing ingredient. So I have bought one of those net style fry containers and put it in a heated five, with an air bubbler. Transferred a bunch of the eyed up eggs from my margarine container of eggs (I collect 5-10 a day from these guys).

Then I also put the margarine container in the tank, floating at the top with a piece of tape holding it to the edge. Also an air bubbler in there.

They are very prolific with the eggs, and they seem tough as heck so plenty of chances to get this right.

[GaryofMontreal]

I'd love to be helpful with this one, from sheer crass self interest as I'd love to buy eggs someday!
I looked it up, and it has a huge range across southern/central Africa. With that, it may not be a hard water fish. Fishbase gives its temperature range as being 20-28, so somewhere in the middle might be a plan. If that doesn't work, water hardness/mineral content could be your enemy. I'd expect it to parallel the needs of Procatopus and Poropanchax to the north of its range - they are the widespread lampeyes that replace it north of Angola.

The popularity of Rift lake fish gives a false idea of what African waters are like. There is hard water outside of the three big lakes - Notho water is hard because it evaporates and becomes quite concentrated, and the Rift lakes are hard because they are fairly closed systems. The rivers that flow all year, even close to the Great lakes, are not especially hard. A lot of African water is Amazonian in its softness.
A lot of the fish have similar egg adaptations to the ones that make hatching South American cichlids, tetras etc difficult in harder water. That could be the problem.
Then again...

[Dan_G_Calgary]

Thanks Gary. You will definetely be getting some once I get this down. It's been an interesting problem. I found a fry in the net today, and the eggs in the margarine container are developing so this might be the answer.

The 7 I have are eggs that I hatched from the pair that I bought, but they hatched in warm weather. I've had endless die off problems with the sudden temperature shift in my fish room/furnace room. When it gets cold outside the temperature in the furnace room shifts hard from the cold air intake for the furnaces. My wife closes the door to keep the dog out, and the ambient temperature tanks, and all the unheated tanks are in jeopardy. Now with them sitting in a heated tank, I think I have a good shot at getting these going.

I might just send you some eggs once the weather clears , just as insurance to make sure they aren't lost all together from my fumbling about.

The group of 7 (haha!) is very cooperative about laying eggs. Some days I collect as many as 10. They are in my cherry shrimpery, so I know they eat well!

[Dan_G_Calgary]

So, when i got back from Pheonix there were 2 fry in the net that had hatched and 4 in the margarine tub that was down to about half an inch of water!

Then tonight 3 more hatched in the margarine container, and I found 2 in the main tank with the parents!

11 fry! I am ready to put them on the BAP! finally! haha!

Thanks again Gary for the pro tip on switching them to what Vince calls 'rainbow hatchery style'. I think we've both been using this more, Vince for his Corys and me for these guys.

[vince0]

i think its hilarious i managed to overlook something as simples as heat :P

if in doubt, please refer to my signature.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

released the fry from the breeder net into the 5 gallon tank (after removing anything that could eat them!).

started another batch of just hatched fry in the breeder net.

coming along nicely now.

Moved the parents to their own tank, away from my shrimp. Egg production about the same.

[CACAdmin]

The fry must love the freedom of the 5 gallon.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

They were trying to get back in the net while I was trying to empty it. And after they all stayed right underneath it. This morning they had ventured out a bit and were checking out their new digs. There are a couple of amano shrimp in there that keep scaring the crap out of them when they move around. :laugh:

[CACAdmin]

I guess it's their natural instinct to be wary of anything new to ensure survival.

[Dan_G_Calgary]

They are doing nicely in the main tank. Seeing their blue eyes, and the characteristic black stripe!

A few more eggs hatched out, so continuing to collect, and cycle them through the process I have set up

Margarine container, light blue with Methylene blue, floating in tank with an air line. When they hatch,

move them to a breeding net. (The square ones with the mesh covering).

When they get big enough to not look like food, will let them in with the older ones in the tank.

Finally getting there Vince! You'll need some tank space for these in a month or so!

[vince0]

They are doing nicely in the main tank. Seeing their blue eyes, and the characteristic black stripe!

A few more eggs hatched out, so continuing to collect, and cycle them through the process I have set up

Margarine container, light blue with Methylene blue, floating in tank with an air line. When they hatch,

move them to a breeding net. (The square ones with the mesh covering).

When they get big enough to not look like food, will let them in with the older ones in the tank.

Finally getting there Vince! You'll need some tank space for these in a month or so!

ive got tank space

[Dan_G_Calgary]

Completed on BAP, and a nice little group of them went home with Vince!

Still have my spawning group, so will probably collect some eggs soon.