Are "Trinidad" guppies endlers?

[traco1]

I saw some of these little colorful guys yesterday but have not heard of the name? Are these another strain of endlers? They were small and had very vivid coloring/markings.

Barb

[Melody]

Just another common name for them:smile: . However, by calling them as such, they may be trying to get around proving that they're pure Endler's, or they're simply not pure Endlers. Could just be an attempt to put a twist on an old product. Might be the name the wholesaler gave them too.

Edit: Did they actually have Endler markings? 'Swords' in the tail? There are also wild Guppies from Trinidad, is why I ask. Either way, they're nothing new, to my knowledge.

[traco1]

Ah, the name game. I believe the tank was all males though, so no breeding females.

Anyone know where you can get true endlers?

[Melody]

There's a few private breeders around - Blainep, Candice, Madda...Mada...that guy from Saskatchewan named Adam...lol. I'd almost bet they're also on the Island somewhere.

[traco1]

Thanks for the names, Melody. I'll go take a look.

[inkognitoguppy]

Ah, the name game. I believe the tank was all males though, so no breeding females.

Anyone know where you can get true endlers?
there are duoble swords, golden double swords, trinidad and endlers at the Pet habitat in richmond center mall richmond b.c. unfortunately they are mixed together and the clerk didnt know which was which. i am new to these wonderfull guppys so i wasnt sure either
a comparison chart of bodytype, markings for us newbies would be great . I dont know for sure what my male is he has double swords but only has a partial black stripe ill try to get a photo up

thanks val summers

[KnaveTO]

Once endlers end up in a tank with guppies (female endlers) purists will never touch them. As the two species cross breed very easily most endler lovers want to know the purity of the fish. There are even classes to endlers now. You may find that information at http://www.endlersr.us/viewtopic.php?t=43

[Melody]

I don't even have to be a purist for that - when I buy an Endler, I want an Endler. Mixing everything up and labelling them something when the females are being hit by something else, is very shabby business at best.

The classes and varieties I think are a bit of a marketing thing, but at least it keeps the purity and ethical aspect alive.

[Melody]

Case in point - this thing was bought as a youngster from BA's in a tank marked 'Endlers Livebearers'. As he grew it became obvious he was a Guppler. Luckily I didn't breed him.

What's worse, he was an obnoxious thing - poked and nipped at everything in the tank. One of the few healthy fish I ever got from them of course - refused to die :rolleyes: .

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/canadiansinternetdotcom/MM-Guppler.jpg

[OldMan]

As KnaveTO said, I won't touch an endler that can't be traced back to wild only stock. I am a registered endler breeder and intend to do my bit for species preservation.
On the other hand, I have seen some very nice P reticulata that were collected in Trinidad. They are very nice looking wild guppies but not related to P wingeii any more than any other P reticulata. I would think they might even be worth doing a preservation project on if you could somehow keep them from the general guppy population. If you start that, people will inevitably try to pass something else off as Trinidad guppies.

[Melody]

The problem with trying to maintain a strain of wild-type Trinidad Guppies is they refuse to stay the same as they were in the wild. Different locations have different degrees of colouration on the fish according to the degree of predation in that particular location. Once the Guppy is removed from their habitat and predation is eliminated, they immediately begin to evolve into a more colourful fish.

The link between colour and mating is second only to camouflage to avoid predation, as both are methods of self-preservation of the species. A dead Guppy can't breed so camouflage wins. When that isn't a factor, each generation is noticably more colourful and in just a few generations the fish no longer look like the collected natives.

The ability to evolve their appearance (including finnage) on a dime, is one of the reasons that many scientists still believe that Wingeii is actually an evolved Guppy strain. At best, a subspecies. But that could be, and has been, debated by people far more learned than I so I'll leave them to it.:smile: