Keeping Empty Tanks Cycled

[KnaveTO]

So... as some of you are aware I am getting a breeding tank and I have a 10 QT tank that will be empty soon (yeah!!!!!)

So my question is when tanks such as those are not in use how do you keep them cycled?

I ask because you never know when you will find that perfect specimin in some store somewhere that you are just not quite sure of (okay... yes that pretty much describes any of the LFS's in Toronto) and for the breeding tank, you never know when your fish will decided that it is time to lay eggs and they sure as heck are not going to give you a month to make sure the tank you have for them is all ready to go.

I have been told to keep a 'spare' filter in my operating tanks and switch it out when necessary... but that really just adds too many filters to them as there are two in each of the tanks already.

So thoughts, suggestions?

[Katalyst]

I keep a few of my brigs in my qt tanks. Not only do they keep my tanks cycled they'll also create infusatoria for the fry I'm hoping to have in the future.

[KnaveTO]

I didn't think that snails could help keep a tank cycled... hmmm... maybe I have to rethink the snail thing...

The only ones I have are Malasian Trumpet Snails to keep the substrate moved about. Either that or at the very least some shrimp in the 40 gallon also might be a decent idea, just they wouldn't be good for the QT tank cause of the meds... hmmm

[CACAdmin]

I keep Brigs in some and Marisas in others (the non planted ones) and they do an excellent job of keeping the QT tanks cycled.

As for shrimp, I may be wrong, but I don't think they produce enough waste to ensure adequate bacteria is present when adding fish. (unless of course you have a zillion of them. :laugh: )

[Katalyst]

I didn't think that snails could help keep a tank cycled... hmmm... maybe I have to rethink the snail thing...

The only ones I have are Malasian Trumpet Snails to keep the substrate moved about. Either that or at the very least some shrimp in the 40 gallon also might be a decent idea, just they wouldn't be good for the QT tank cause of the meds... hmmm

MTS I'm not sure about. But my brigs, cana's, haustrums & spixies have no trouble keeping my tanks cycled. I'd have to agree with Jay on the shrimp but I keep a baby brig or two in my shrimp tanks just in case.

[KnaveTO]

Oh dear God.... you guys are infecting me with actually thinking of keeping a few snails... and succeeding... lol

Time to take a peek at the snail sites and see what is out there that is relatively easy to keep and heardy at the same time

Besides... thinking about it, I do not want shrimp in the breeding tank as they will compete with the fry for food...

[Katalyst]

Oh dear God.... you guys are infecting me with actually thinking of keeping a few snails... and succeeding... lol

Time to take a peek at the snail sites and see what is out there that is relatively easy to keep and heardy at the same time

Besides... thinking about it, I do not want shrimp in the breeding tank as they will compete with the fry for food...

I've already tainted Ciddian with brigs and well some cories that didn't fit into my breeding plans. Brigs are easy as are spixi's, actually their all easy. Brigs and Spixies require less room then cana's who are devious and haustrums (my favorite). Deep down that you really want some anyways.

If you think snails are bad, wait till you end up with goldfish! :rofl:

[KnaveTO]

Alright then... so what would be safe around eggs and plants (vals, moss and swords)?

[Katalyst]

Alright then... so what would be safe around eggs and plants (vals, moss and swords)?
Goldfish! ROFL

My brigs will only nibble at decayed or very tender plants. No one ever munched my swords other then my Cana.

[CACAdmin]

Brigs! They don't have the ability to munch any plants unless they are softened and decaying. You know you want some! :laugh:

[Katalyst]

You know you want some! :laugh:

ROFL@ that comment...

I happen to know a very lovely snail breeder in the GTA area as well. And right now I'd trade just about anything in this house for some chocolate, okay not my goldfish; but definately my snails.

[hp10BII]

What type of filters do you use? If it's like an Aquaclear HOB, I add extra biomedia, sponge, ceramic rings etc and transfer that to the qtank. Right now I have a QT empty that I was treating metro on some fish and I keep the filter fed with household ammonia.

[Katalyst]

What type of filters do you use? If it's like an Aquaclear HOB, I add extra biomedia, sponge, ceramic rings etc and transfer that to the qtank. Right now I have a QT empty that I was treating metro on some fish and I keep the filter fed with household ammonia.
I'd be interested in hearing the amounts you add and how often. I've tried this a few times and ended up with quite a few bumps that led to mini cycles.

[hp10BII]

Don't need much ammonia, 1 to 2 ppm ammonia will keep the bacteria going. Just something for the nitrifying bacteria to snack on. I think with 1 to 2 ppm ammonia, that would be more than enough to support a good # of fish in a QT. I don't worry about spikes because you would do a complete waterchange before adding your fish because the Nitrates should be sky high. Mini cycles are a good thing...it shows that the biofilter is trying to increase to the new workload and adding to your safety margin. Since there's no fish in there, nothing is being harmed.

[hp10BII]

Forgot to add...for me, a little bit of ammonia every couple of days is sufficient to keep the biofilters running.

[KnaveTO]

what is a little bit... how many drops or cc's per gallon?

[hp10BII]

The problem is that not all Household ammonias have the same concentration of ammonia, also shelf life decreases the potency over time so YMMV!! My generic brand of household ammonia took 50 ml ammonia to raise levels to about 3 ppm in a 65 gallon tank. But in any case, you need to use your ammonia test kit to calibrate how much ammonia to seed your tank.

[Katalyst]

Don't need much ammonia, 1 to 2 ppm ammonia will keep the bacteria going. Just something for the nitrifying bacteria to snack on. I think with 1 to 2 ppm ammonia, that would be more than enough to support a good # of fish in a QT. I don't worry about spikes because you would do a complete waterchange before adding your fish because the Nitrates should be sky high. Mini cycles are a good thing...it shows that the biofilter is trying to increase to the new workload and adding to your safety margin. Since there's no fish in there, nothing is being harmed.
The spikes without the fish aren't the problem. The mini cycles seem to happen when adding the fish, and when a fish is already in a weakened state a mini cycle is the last thing it needs. For some reason I seem to incur almost every single time and since there is no shortage of brigs in this house, it just seems to be the pathof least resistance for me. :spinny:

[hp10BII]

The spikes without the fish aren't the problem. The mini cycles seem to happen when adding the fish, and when a fish is already in a weakened state a mini cycle is the last thing it needs. For some reason I seem to incur almost every single time and since there is no shortage of brigs in this house, it just seems to be the path of least resistance for me. :spinny:

hmmm...no idea how much ammonia a brig would contribute to the biofilter. I guess adding more brigs when there are no fishies and taking them out when the fish are added doesn't help?

There are other breeders that uses just airstones and relying on daily waterchanges to keep everything in check...great if you have the energy, time and/or slave labour.

That's one of the reasons I like fishless cycling, it produces way more biofilter capacity than any reasonable amount of fish in any tank, QT or display. IMO that's ideal, but it is still easier just to raid one of my existing filters' biomedia. :yes:

[Katalyst]

Brigs are quite messy and contribute quite a bit. Adding brigs to the tank and pulling them out to add fish actually helps quite a bit. Brigs keep my tanks completely cycled, using established media of course. My filters vary from Aqua Clears to Sumps to Wet Dry, Cannisters (Ehiem, Fluvals) to Bio Wheels, I keep tons of extra media in one of my wet dry filters, which is amazing for biological filtration. Perhaps its me being lazy and also that I breed brigs so there's never a shortage of brigs in this house but I find it a lot easier to maintain then the ammonia, but to each his or hew own. Then again I have 12+ tanks running so it gets a little nuts around here at times with the waterchanges and whatnot.

[thegrandpoohbah]

The method I use right now seems to work well and you don't have to worry about keeping an empty tank running. I use a 10G as my quarantine tank and run an Aquaclear mini filter. When not in use, the filter sponge for the mini resides in the basket of my AC300 where it stays cycled. When I need a quarantine tank I just fill the 10G with water from the big tank and then start up the filter using the cycled sponge.

[Melody]

Alright then... so what would be safe around eggs and plants (vals, moss and swords)?

Sorry, none can be trusted with eggs :no: . They don't appear to eat all varieties, but finding out which ones they like and which they don't could be a bad experience.

[Tanya in Moncton NB]

I have a 15g QT that I keep running in between occupants but it's not always cycled.

When I buy new fish, I do a large water change and take an existant sponge from another established tank and add that to it.

When, I'm done, I usually do a large water change to lessen the likelyhood of any potential diseases. If I have a big disease in there (not often) I drain the tank and diseinfect it with hot water and salt.

The tank is barebottom and usually in an uncycled sitiuation when I'm using medications. I don't bother trying to cycle it when it's being medicated...no point really sicne the bacteria usually dies! I just do large daily water changes until the fish are healthy and safe to go in the main tank.

After I've stopped medication, I do large water changes to remove meds (sometimes carbon) and then I add the sponge from the established tank...I keep the fish in observation for at least 3 weeks before adding to main tank.

[KnaveTO]

Unfortunately I use canister filters on all my main tanks and the breeder is on a pair of sponges and the QT uses a Fluval 2+ So moving around established media isn't an option for me. I guess I will have to try to remember to add ammonia every so often to the tanks to keep them cycled when not in use.

[thegrandpoohbah]

Unfortunately I use canister filters on all my main tanks and the breeder is on a pair of sponges and the QT uses a Fluval 2+ So moving around established media isn't an option for me.

You'd be surprised. I have cut Aquaclear foam blocks in half to fit them in a canister filter to keep cycled. When the time came to set the tank up again I just sandwiched them together in the media basket and put an new foam block on top to hold them down. I believe the Fluval 2+ uses foam pads so it should be possible to squeeze them into a canister filter.