Internal Parasites

[fishenthusiast]

I find myself in need of a medication that will treat internal parasites successfully. I have had no luck with the medicated food so I am hoping to find a medication that can be put in the water.

I need to treat angels, all are almost 1 year old and are exhibiting signs of internal parasites. I will be treating them in a 33G bare bottom tank.

Any and all suggestions appreciated.

Thanks!

[Melody]

Hands down, Praziquantel, brand 'Prazipro'. It looks expensive but that's because its concentrated and you usually only need one dose. Treats Tapeworm, Flatworms, Turbellarians and Flukes. If its a nematode such as Camallanus Worms, contact mentor 'Mykiss' for Levamisole Hyrdrochloride.

Jungle also has an internal parasite treatment and it too contains Praziquantel. However, I've never had much luck with it. I suspect there's not enough in it.

You can also soak their regular food or freeze-dried bloodworms & the like, in a garlic solution. I do both if I suspect them.

They're not always easy to erradicate, but the above works for me after trying countless other methods.

I've been experimenting with herbal remedies but I can only do it when I happen to see a fish with them in quarantine so its slow going. If I see consistent results, I'll be sure to post.

I hope you get rid of them soon!

[fishenthusiast]

I am pretty sure it is hexamita. I read metronidazole is a good medication for it, and that is what is in the medicated food. I will continue to try to feed the fish the medicated food and perhaps do a bath. I read that I can mix the medicine in with frozen food and then refreeze it. Can I get metronidazole in powder form?

Is Praziquantel just as good for hexamita? I am willing to try anything at this point. I have lost both the parents of the angels that I need to treat. First my big male got very very sick and died. I thought he had hole in the head because he got injured and then stressed when I moved. It is now 6 months later and my female got sick and I ended up having to euthanize her last week. I am now noticing one of their offspring is starting to lose a lot of weight and they have white stringy poop. I have, on occasion, seen white stringy poop from all of the offspring I kept. I really like these fish and I want to do anything I can to help them get better.

[Melody]

Ah, that's a whole different ball game then. You're on the right track with the metronidazole - its the most frequently recommended as an effective treatment. Its not good as a water treatment though, hence it being better utilized if ingested. It comes as a powder to be mixed with food and frozen, but I don't know if you can get it locally. When I fed the medicated pellets before, they were too big for my fish so I put it in a bag and hammered the bejeebers out of it....lol. There's a recipe that you can add the med's to here (http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/VM053). I doubt that Praziquantel would help, unfortunately.

Other than that, all I know of is daily waterchanges with thorough gravel vac's, new filter media and a good diet. Garlic is also an appetite stimulant, so sneak some of that into the recipe if you do it.

:hugs: They're lucky to have you working so hard to bring them back to good health. Keep the faith and let us know how its going.

[hp10BII]

I used metronidazole in fizzy tablet form as a water treatment. My fish weren't going to eat regardless what I tried feeding them.

When I was looking for metronidazole about a year and a half ago, King Ed & Rainforest carried this:

http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/Metronidazole.html

[fishenthusiast]

I used metronidazole in fizzy tablet form as a water treatment. My fish weren't going to eat regardless what I tried feeding them.

When I was looking for metronidazole about a year and a half ago, King Ed & Rainforest carried this:

http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/Metronidazole.html

Did you find the fizzy tablet worked? Was it to treat hexamita? Was the tablet from Jungle?

My fish will take the pellets in their mouth and then spit it out. It isn't too big for them, but they don't like the taste. They are pretty used to being spoiled rotten with food so I don't blame them.

i have been doing daily water changes on that tank for a while now, I think the stress of moving from one house to another twice in 3 months precipitated the disease. Since moving here in July I have moved the fish from the 55G to the 33G and back again (not all in the same day or anything though). There aren't any external signs of the disease yet which is why I wanted to treat it right away.

I think I will try grinding the food up with some bloodworms and brine shrimp. They love both of those. I have to do something, I don't want to lose my babies!

[Melody]

Let it soak in the mix for a bit so it takes on the taste. Are you positive its Hex? If there's no outward signs it may be normal internal parasites. I know they're prone to Hex so I can see where your thought process is going. Its so hard to nail this stuff with any certainty without a microscope.

I'm not sure if the Jungle internal treatment tackles Hex or not - its certainly worth checking out. Its an all-purpose thing so it would also cover your anal fin if its something else. I'm not big on blindly throwing med's at something, but I'm familiar with the desperation involved with watching masses of fish die. :( Poor thing, you must be beside yourself :hugs: .

[fishenthusiast]

Let it soak in the mix for a bit so it takes on the taste. Are you positive its Hex? If there's no outward signs it may be normal internal parasites. I know they're prone to Hex so I can see where your thought process is going. Its so hard to nail this stuff with any certainty without a microscope.

I'm not sure if the Jungle internal treatment tackles Hex or not - its certainly worth checking out. Its an all-purpose thing so it would also cover your anal fin if its something else. I'm not big on blindly throwing med's at something, but I'm familiar with the desperation involved with watching masses of fish die. :( Poor thing, you must be beside yourself :hugs: .

The reason I think it is hex is both mom and dad started to get sores that look like this (advance warning, it isn't pretty):




http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y145/Fishenthusiast/PICT0063.jpg

I figure if mom and dad got it the babies would too. When dad first got sick I thought I had caused it by not keeping his water clean enough after he was injured (he got stuck behind a piece of slate trying to rescue some of his babies). Then mom started to get these little ulcers on her head that had these white stringy looking things coming out of them. I read that is sometimes a symptom of hex. I assume that because both mom and dad got so sick so fast that if I don't treat what I can't see now it might be too late in the future.

I have just gotten home from working and having dinner with family for hubby's birthday, so I am going to try the food soaked in with some tasty treats. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Edit: I just took a closer look at the food I got and it contains praziquantel. It also says it treats hole in the head and the lady at Big Als says it's main ingredient is metronidazole(who knows if she is right or not, I do know she has worked there for a long time). I am trying to find the ingredient list as the bottle doesn't list them but the jungle labs website appears to be down at this time. I'll keep searching......

[Melody]

Sounds like Anchor Worms with the stringy things - have you seen anchor worms before? You can google it to see if its similar. I know you've been doing this for awhile so I don't mean to sound like I'm questioning your diagnosis, I'd just like to see you get rid of it asap. I'm a fixer - I need to fix it for you... its a personality flaw...lol.

[Melody]

Did you find the Wet Web Media article about Metranidazole while researching? I just came across it while looking for something else. Its a great article and gives you some specifics on soaking:

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/metranidazole.htm

[hp10BII]

Did you find the fizzy tablet worked? Was it to treat hexamita? Was the tablet from Jungle?



The fish was too far gone, I suspected that is was hex. The fizzy tablet was not a Jungle product, it was "behind the counter", sold for $1 apiece, dosage was good for 10 gallons. Apparently it was a product used by many of the Asian discus breeders.

[fishenthusiast]

I am pretty sure that it is hex. The holes start first then get this sort of worm like thing protruding from the middle. Both parents and the fish I have now have long white/clear stringy poop so it is definately internal. I am going to try altering their diet and upping the water changes, just in case it is something I am doing that is causing it. I will also continue with the medicated food. I couldn't find any powdered Metranidazole to make my own food today so I will have to stick with what I have.

At least the angels I have left aren't exhibiting any outward signs of disease, no head erosion or holes developing. I am going to keep my fingers crossed that I am to blame for not feeding enough variety or something.

[mixixe]

I didn't know that little cichlids get HITH too...

well this is what I did to get rid of it, I added a uv sterilizer, and fed high quality pellets, and i do a water change (50%) 2-3 times a week. Before adding the uv sterilizer nothing worked, even with the heavy water changes and quality pellets. The hole kept getting larger each day. Added UV sterilizer = gone in two weeks.

Hex is the water column and I think only affects weakened fish, watever the reason it may be for the weakness, if youc an't fix that, at least you can kill it in the water column with the uv sterilzer, that was my reasoning, and it had worked in conjunction with all the other stuff. Now my UV sterilzer is in there all the time.

But luckily for me, I had a spare one, and they are quite pricey. Good luck!

Worms might be coming in and out b/c the fish may also have external parasites b/c they are weakened too... salt bath works well for that.

[Melody]

Ah the voice of experience - nothing like it. My Cichlid experience is more from a wannabe angle...lol. Sounds like good advice.

Watch those Boxing Day sales for UV sterilizers, that's when I got mine. Be sure to get a high enough wattage to kill everything - the cheaper, lower wattage systems don't kill anything but algae. They don't replace good maintenance though.

Salt and Melafix would also reduce the bacteria levels in the meantime, and the salt would treat the external parasites as mentioned.

[fishenthusiast]

I am now completely confused.

I am pretty sure mom and dad died from HITH. Their babies (which aren't really babies, they will be 1 year on boxing day) I'm not so sure that they have the same thing. I was looking in the tank the other day and this is what I saw my fish excreting. User beware, photo may contain fish poop.....:wideeyed:







http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y145/Fishenthusiast/FishPoo.jpg


So, can this thing be identified??? I know it is a worm of some kind (at least I am pretty sure, it didn't look like poop to me) but I am not sure what kind of worm. Not all of my fish have stringy white poop, only a couple and only the angels. I have Boesmani Rainbows and SAE's in the tank with the angels. I want to treat this right so I don't lose my babies....

[mixixe]

only worm i've heard of that comes out of the anus is this.

Good luck

http://www.finarama.com/diseases/camallanus_content.htm

[Melody]

Probably Tapeworm. Could be a secondary infection but it has to be treated regardless.

I noticed the other day that AngelsPlus.com sells medicated flakes for internal parasites and nematodes. I don't know what the medicinal ingredient is but you could always ask him. He ships to Canada if you want to give it a whirl.

I'd keep feeding the food and add the PraziPro to the mix. Internals can be such a battle. You could also PM our resident mentor, Mr. Mykiss. He knows his worms. Now there's something to put on your resume' hmmm? lol Seriously, he's ID'ed for me a couple of times now.

[fishenthusiast]

Tapeworm was my first thought too. I looked up some pictures, and it didn't really look like what I saw. But the pictures I saw were of large commercial fish. The fish refuse to eat the medicated food. I have tried crushing it, soaking it and just feeding it straight but they are smart little buggers and they don't like me switching up their food on them. Unless of course it is to give them bloodworms, or other treats.

Methinks I will PM MyKiss. He might be able to help. Although, shouldn't the mentor be in the emergency section ready to offer advice? :twitcy:

Probably Tapeworm. Could be a secondary infection but it has to be treated regardless.

I noticed the other day that AngelsPlus.com sells medicated flakes for internal parasites and nematodes. I don't know what the medicinal ingredient is but you could always ask him. He ships to Canada if you want to give it a whirl.

I'd keep feeding the food and add the PraziPro to the mix. Internals can be such a battle. You could also PM our resident mentor, Mr. Mykiss. He knows his worms. Now there's something to put on your resume' hmmm? lol Seriously, he's ID'ed for me a couple of times now.

[Melody]

LOL I picked a wonderful mentor, he's educated and highly experienced in the trade. Unfortunately he never has any time to goof off with us. :laugh: If I wasn't so damn picky about who I label as mentors, he might get a little help around here.

Sorry to hear that they're refusing the food. I think I'll order some from AngelsPlus just to have on hand, but I want to verify what's in it first. Then I have to find out how stable the ingredient is so I know how long I can store it. He mentions in his information that it does taste horrible and its best to get them used to his flakes so they'll scarf it down without 'tasting' it first.

If its any comfort, although the fish can get malnourished eventually, a parasite isn't out to kill its host - its not in its best interest. If you're not still starving them to get them to take the med's, feed frequently so they get their nutrition.

Now that I think of it, if HITH can be caused by lack of nutrition, it would make sense that your Tapeworm is the culprit and the HITH is the secondary infection.:FishQuestion: