New User - Possible Ammonia Problem

[Epic]

HI all,

Background:
It's been about 15+ years since I ran an aquarium. So, i got back into it and this is what I did.

First I setup my Used/Clean 29 Gallon Tank w/ Magnum 350D Canister filter w/ activated Carbon. used Nutrafin AquaPLUS and Nutrafin Cycle to treat the water and left the tank to cycle for 3 days.

Water tested good so I dropped in 5 zebra Danios and two peppered Cory catfish.

Cycled with fish for 2 weeks. Then introduced 3 black Skirt tetras, 3 black phantom tetras and 3 neon tetras.

Two neons died withing 24 hours. replaced them, then three neons went in another 24 hours.. (I should mention the first one died within an hour after being introduced into the tank).

Then two of my danios went and i bought two more, but didnt realize that one was a long finned danio... he went within a few hours.

I introduce fish by placing bag into tank for time to match water temp and also put my tank water in the bag slowy and then after an hour or two slowing let them swim out of the bag into the tank.
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It's now been two months since i started the tank and for the last month, I have had no deaths. Fish havent seemed to ever be better than they are now. Tank is fully of life!

2 Cory Cats, 3Neons, 3 Black Phantoms, 3 Black Skirt, 4 Zebra Danios living the fun and pretty active community tank.

Here's my problem.

In the last two weeks i've notice my ammonia jump from 0.5 to 2.0!!!!!

I clean almost every three days and do water changes of about 15-20% every two-three days as well as vacuum the rocks and when i do the changes.

This last week, i've used AMMO-Lock and two days ago i put a cup of AMMO-chips in with my carbon in my bio-canister.

I" have also decreased the frequency of my feeding and the amount to about one less day ever 6-7 days.

0--------------------0

Is it possible that the tank is doing another Cycle and that is the reason for the jump in ammonia?

Help!

Thanks,

Epic

EDIT: I should also mention that ive had the light on for 10-12 hours a day because I work that long and havent had a timer purchased to mantain the ligj.. so there is a small amount of brownish algae on the times of plants and deor...

[Pamelajo]

Hi and Welcome,
Your tank could be doing a mini cycle? I have no experience with products you are using, so not sure if they help, hinder of mask test readings. Couple of questions to help figure out what is going on. Over the first two months did you ever take nitrite or nitrate readings? Have you been cleaning your filter, if so how are you doing it.
Keep doing the water changes and if ammonia keeps rising or staying steady you may have to up the waterchanges to everyday until this is over.

[blainep]

Or you have a dead body in the tank somewhere.

Lots of water changes and use a water conditioner like Prime that will bind with the ammonia and make it less toxic.

[GaryofMontreal]

I notice you said you cleaned every 3 days. How do you clean? What is involved?
I'm a great believer that a too clean tank is like a paved meadow.
Do you feed more than once a day? I feed twice a day for livebearers (with one day fast for adult fish), but with tetras, it's six feedings per week.

[Epic]

Thanks,

Fish get fed every morning around 9am, I usually skip a feeding every 4 days and sometimes on the 8th day. (I work 4on - 4off so i usuall skip feedings on my first day on and sometimes my first day off, but not the same week)


My current water readings are

GH -30
KH -40
pH - 7.0
N02 - 0
N03 - 0

I check with strips every 3-4 days

pH has always been at 7.0, Notrate and Nitrite have not gone above 0 in the last month and General hardness has been at 60 max, Kh was at 80 about a month ago.

I use the API Ammonia test kit with the two droppers.

I clean by lightly scrubbing Decor with a tank brush, and vacuum the rocks using a Top Fin® Gravel Vacuum to remove waste. I usually remove the large decor when vacuuming.

I have a glass scrubber which i haven't needed yet, and the water, 99.98% of the time, is crystal clear!

I haven't swapped out the media filter yet, I just added a cup of AMMO chips to in with the carbon to help with the ammonia... now., that was only two days ago but...running the Magnun 350 on a 29gal tank the entire tank water should cycle every 6 minutes,...

I havent rinsed out my filter sleeve yet as its only been two months/ When i put the ammo-chips in, it didnt look that dirty at all.

Is there any other information I can help give?
Thanks for all your input, I really appreciate it!! :Smile:

OOH... and no dead fish! They actually haven't looked better than they do now!!

Epic

EDIT: I use API AMMO-Lock to help make the ammonia less toxic.

[GaryofMontreal]

It seems you're doing things right. I see nothing that could be causing your problem. Have you tried testing your tap water with the kit?

Or could it BE the kit?

Could you have dead snails?

A lot of aquarists spend a lot of time worrying about water testing. I'm an experienced freshwater aquarist, since I've had tanks for 44 years now. Even I can learn in that time. I haven't done a water test in ages, except to see what I had going when I moved, or to check hardness in doctored water. I used to test weekly. It was part of my hobby, but in hindsight, probably not part of the success I had. It was just a fun thing to do.
I have never lost a tank to new tank syndrome or to ammonia in a new set-up. I believe the majority of fish losses due to cycling problems are not from that cause at all, but from inexperienced aquarists being sold poor quality/unhealthy fish for their new tanks. If you don't crowd your tanks, don't overfeed and do water changes, you can keep fish in a tank that has held water for just long enough to be dechlorinated. The cycle is not a myth - you can keep one fish ten gallons at the start, but a cycle is to be respected and not worried about.

With that unpopular perspective, I would ease up on the vacuuming, stick to my water changes and stay the course. Don't add new fish, and remember that you are trying to make the tank, and not just the filter, a friendly home for useful bacteria.

[vince0]

Hey i was just going through your test results and something popped out at me. You should have some nitrates in your water. Considering you've got a 29g with a very low bio-load (not that many fish) it could be that its taking longer to fully cycle your tank. You may just want to do additional water changes until your tank shows zero ammonia and zero nitrites. When you start showing nitrates, you know your beneficial bacteria is doing its job.

[Blossom112]

Try and get some free or cheap plants to throw in if you can .
This should help in a day or 2 so the remaining fish dont die .

I am now cycling , from scratch and 2 months later It is still showing nitrites I figure another month or 2 .... oh what a long wait !

[Epic]

Try and get some free or cheap plants to throw in if you can ......

I was wanting to do live plants but I dont think my light has the WATTs to maintain them. If I do live plants I want to change the gravel to a much smaller and finer type and also a more earthy color... not the white/baby blue I have now :)

I have a feeling that the tank is still completing its cycle and its just taking more time to convert the ammonia to Nitrites and then nitrates. I've read in a few places that the initial cycle could take two months, and in some case maybe even three.

On the safe side, I was thinking that it could be the glass tube that came with my kit, so I will try another ammonia test in a few days (once im on days off).

As said before, the fish have not seemed healthier and more alive, the water is crystal clear and from that, i'm happy! (grumble: just wish the ammonia didnt test so high... lol)

[RescuePenguin]

Given the info you have presented and questions you have answered, I am going along with the people that believe that you haven't yet built up the beneficial bacteria. My question is why are you scrubbing the decor, is there something growing on it? The use of Ammo chips is making me wonder if you are inadvertently preventing a proper cycle.
As painful as it is, the tank needs a proper cycle. I would temp. stop the vacuums and the cleaning until it cycles properly. The key is the amount of surface area in your aquarium, plant and decor for the bacteria to adhere to. If others agree I would stop the Ammo chips too. I have never used them, so I don't know the ins and outs of using them, but by controlling the ammonia you might be preventing the build up of bacteria that breaks it down into nitrites.

Steve

[Blossom112]

When I say that I mean , cheap plants tend to need very low light .... like throw away plants .
Just long enough for them to get the bad stuff out of your water .

I do this ... when my plants over grow in one tank I clip and just toss them in another tank if needed .

[Epic]

..... My question is why are you scrubbing the decor, is there something growing on it? ..... Steve

There is a brownish algae forming on the top and tips of the decor and the some parts of the gravel. From what I understand, its from me leaving the light on for more than 8 hours. I have yet to purchase a timer and since i turn the light on before i leave for work, then off about 10-12 hours later when I get home.

I think it is the inital cycle and I will cut back on cleaning and remove the ammo-chips for now and let it work itself for a few more weeks and monitor levels.

Hopefully all is well and its just the Cycle.


Epic

[vince0]

those are diatoms and not an actual form of algea, if you find them unsightly, you could pick up some nerite snails, they will gobble it right up and also keep eating any other algea in check :)

[GaryofMontreal]

I tend to get brown algae when I don't have enough light. When the plants are doing well (14 hours on a timer) I never see it, but when the fluorescents get old and aren't replaced and the fish to live plant ratio is out of whack, I get brown algae.

[Epic]

First off, You all have been awesome, I appreciate all of your input. Thanks a bunch!!

Now, after doing some further reading and also the "Carbon In Filters (http://www.canadianaquariumconnection.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9543) by Kimr" post I was wondering if that could also be a cause to my late and long cycle.

The only filter I have at the moment is a Magnum 350 Deluxe. I am using the carbon canister and its full of Marineland Activated Carbon.

If I was to use my second carbon/media canister, and pack it full of Foam and put that in there, do you think it would function better as a bio-filter??

I bought 3 rite-size sleeves and two carbon/media canisters for the 350 so I could do easy swaps when needed...

OR should I keep the carbon in the 350 and buy a Marineland Penguin Bio-Wheel Aquarium Power Filter 150B($30) or 200B($35) ??
:err:

[Pamelajo]

When I was using regular filters, I never used carbon just double sponges. Now that I have switched to sponge filters, each tank has too. I am not sure if it would speed up the cycle, but once it has cycled I think it would be beneficial. Plus if you start up another tank you can use it in the new tank to jump start.